Educating Entrepreneurs

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1. 0:02
   Wes Mathews

   This is the unfiltered truth about entrepreneurship. Raw, no BS, no sugarcoating. Welcome to Entrepreneur Intel. I'm your host, Wes Mathews. Each episode, we'll learn from experienced founders and uncover the top 5% learnings that led to their success in all things personal, family and business. This show is sponsored by Stealth Consulting, delivering clear marketing strategies, ROI and no surprises. So really excited for today's guest. Today's guest, he is a Harvard MBA. In 1996, he founded, led and grew the MBA exchange and then sold in 2016. So my math is right.

   That's about 20 years. The company served for 100 consultants, did business in 11 countries and over 5,000 clients and made the Inc. 5000 several times. So in 2019, he founded Inc. magazine's Young Entrepreneurs program that is now in Columbia, Yale, Duke, University of Michigan and UC Berkeley. President of Bauer and Associates. Welcome, Dan, Dan Bauer. Welcome.

2. 1:15
   Dan Bauer

   Thanks so much, Wes. I'm thrilled to be with you today and appreciate the chance to share my story.

3. 1:20
   Wes Mathews

   What's awesome. So I love your intro. There's so much to pick apart there. But I got to ask you the question I asked everybody who is brave enough to come on here. No, no, it's it's an honor to have you here. So you've been doing this for a long time. You've been an entrepreneur, you have a wealth of experience. What's one of the most important lessons you've learned thus far?

4. 1:41
   Dan Bauer

   I think it's to not fall in love with my first idea. Typically, it's the second or third iteration of it that really hits the sweet spot. And so, you know, keeping my eyes and ears open during that initial, you know, development, and not dying, you know, not falling on my own sword, you know, pivoting from the idea you love to one that maybe you like, but can fall in love with, for me has worked quite well.

5. 2:13
   Wes Mathews

   So I mean, did you always knew you're gonna be an entrepreneur? So I see Harvard MBA. And like that, that's amazing. Because that's a very limited amount of people that can say they have an MBA from Harvard. But like, at what point did you realize that you're you're an entrepreneur?

6. 2:27
   Dan Bauer

   Well, great question. Sure, I should have realized it a lot earlier, I'll say that. I'm a third generation entrepreneur. And, you know, I should have listened to my heart a little bit earlier, I was a corporate America guy, for the first 20 years of my career. I worked in the ad agency business, DDB Needham, which is a pretty large outfit. And then I went into banking, bank marketing, with the Bank of Hawaii, and then Citibank, and then MasterCard after that. So I was a corporate cat for the first half of my career.

   And came to the realization that, you know, I'd rather bet on myself and the marketplace as variables, instead of a corporate infrastructure, and the whims of managers, and decided, frankly, there was less risk and higher upside in being a 24 seven entrepreneur. And that's what triggered it for me.

7. 3:26
   Wes Mathews

   And I never looked back after that. But doesn't corporate America give you that cushy protection and that steady paycheck coming in? Like, how did you how did you leave all that to go down this path of crazy uncertainty and betting on yourself?

8. 3:42
   Dan Bauer

   So the answer is yes, it definitely does that. I used to refer to that as the velvet pit. It was nice and cushy and soft and dark. But it's also constraining and stifling. And I just had enough of it at some point. Now, for me, the way that I did the transition was a very smooth one. That is, I started to work on my business plan a couple years before I left corporate America. So this was my go to my happy place. If I had a tough day or a tough week in the office, I'd go into my business plan and tweak it and hone it.

   And by the time it was as good as I could get it, I was truly ready to ready to leave. So it was not abrupt. In that sense, I'd been, you know, greasing the skids here for this, for that change for quite a while. And it was good for my mental health as a corporate guy. And then I was really confident when I hit the deck, entrepreneurially.

9. 4:45
   Wes Mathews

   So I think it's a good point, right? So you started building this venture while you were employed on somebody else's, you know, in their organization, where they get super important, right? A lot of people get stuck in that. Yeah, I personally think like, that's, that would be harder and more nerve wracking, having the idea that like, you could be terminated from your job at any day. And at least if I want to get fired, I want the client to fire me because of what I did relative to somebody else.

   But yes, but amen to that. You know, you founded the company in 96, right? So I'm 43, I think back of 1996. I'm 15. The iPhone doesn't exist. Internet sort of just came out, right? Like the technology and things that you were doing with that you were dealing with at that time, but you grew a company to a hundred consultants, 11 countries, 5,000 clients. How did you take that leap? And like, how did, you know, because I want to talk about like you founded it, let it grew it.

   But how did you come up with that idea? Or like, what really drove you to that specific company?

10. 5:43
    Dan Bauer

    So first of all, it was really a blessing for me that I did it when I did, because I'm not a technology whiz by a mile. And so it was pretty simple in the mid to late 90s. I had an AOL, if anyone remembers AOL, that was my address, [email removed]. I had a laptop that I had this ancient Zenith laptop that was assigned to me at Harvard. And I got a high school kid to do a simple website for me for 100 bucks. And I had an extra bedroom, and that's where I started this thing.

    And it was very easy to get search engine rankings. There were a few registries in those days, or directories, I guess they call them. Those names are, you know, ancient history, Alta Vista, things like that that maybe you heard about. So it was not hard to get some bandwidth, let's say, visibly. So technologically, that's the way it started. The conversion of factors that led to me starting that business were really the following. As I said, my career in corporate America was geared toward marketing. And so I knew how to develop a brand and promote a brand.

    And so my decision was, okay, I'm going to be the brand, I'm going to become the brand. So that skill set was there. And again, the technology was simple in those days, even I could do it. And so I was able to get some visibility. Then I got published in a few magazines about articles about MBA education that had been really the flipping of that switch of getting me into business school and learning general management, and really broadening my horizons there, instilled a very powerful motivation for learning and growth and, you know, self-development.

    And so I combined all those things and decided I would launch a mini MBA course. So as I said earlier, this pivot that I made was, my initial idea was a bomb. It did not fly. I was taking Harvard Business School case materials, getting fellow Harvard graduates, and we were going to do a live mini MBA program. Well, everything was there except the customers. People wanted either the real thing or not at all in those days. So I said, okay, I drew back on my experience.

    I had been an alumni interviewer for Harvard Business School after I graduated. So I was able to assess young professionals as to their aptitude and motivation and potential for making the most of a Harvard MBA. So I had that skill set and that knowledge. I added that to the mix and decided I would pivot my business and become an advisory firm for 20-somethings who didn't know quite what to do with their career. What were they missing? Did they need a new job? Adding an extracurricular activity of some sort, travel, launching a side gig to test their entrepreneurial waters.

    And so that's what I did. My mentoring and coaching passion and I think course skill in that added to the mix and that became the MBA exchange. And from that point on, it just took off from me and the laptop to, again, ultimately 100 colleagues around the world.

11. 9:27
    Wes Mathews

    So I love to dive in there. So as an entrepreneur, I think the sexy word scale, right? But you think consulting and it's hard to scale yourself. So you're the MBA guy having all the conversations. So how did you take at that time, your vision, your concept, and then project that on other consultants, right? Because I think that's an important thing that everybody wants scale, but when you're the big piece of it, right, at some point you have to turn it over and how did you go about that?

12. 10:03
    Dan Bauer

    Okay, great question. So I looked in the marketplace for people whose credentials would be marketable. In other words, having that Harvard, Stanford, Wharton MBA degree themselves. I also looked for entrepreneurs who had time and knew how to handle themselves out there without that corporate cushion that we talked about who'd be quick on their feet, decisive leaders. And then I hired slowly. I built trust with potential consultants by having them sit in on client consultations with me. We did a very slow hand off. I would then sit in on their first consultations with clients to hear how they did, and then I would back off a little more, and then I would talk to the client who worked with them and ask them for their feedback.

    So I did this slow hire process in which I saw and observed directly and indirectly how my new consultants handled themselves with clients. And one by one, I built it very slowly. I also fired fast. I think that's important. It was basically one strike and you're out because dealing with the future of a client who was putting his or her hopes into this consultant to give them candid, actionable feedback, there was no room for error in that. So if I observed something that was not up to my standards or if the client, that first client didn't give me glowing feedback, I'd know this was not a good match.

    So I built it slowly over years with that same process, the slow handoff. I trained them with everything I knew and then turned them loose and just watched. And over time, and then frankly after probably five or ten years, I didn't have to recruit anymore because their friends and their colleagues saw how much fun and satisfaction that my hires were having that they asked me if they could bring their friends into it. So truly, I didn't have to market to find good people and I could add scale organically and that's a great way to add scale.

13. 12:28
    Wes Mathews

    So what's interesting is you started a bit like you've got your Harvard MBA, you're using your prior experience, you launch a company. But from when you started and launched that company, what you're working on in five to ten years was completely different. Were you just now spending all your time to train your consultants or were you also, you get that thing where the one client wants to hang on to you, right? Nobody can do it as good as you. Did you ever get to a point where you were out of client work and just dealing with consultants?

14. 12:56
    Dan Bauer

    I did absolutely. That's a terrific memory that you're dusting off for me there. This was a huge leap in this business. The good news, bad news is I was so passionate about the coaching and mentoring of the clients that I was hesitant to leave that and also the difficulties of scaling as you observed before. But I realized that I had a higher level of mentoring and coaching that I could do and that was of the consultants rather than the clients. If I could impart in them and get them to internalize the same mindset, the same frameworks that I had developed, that would be a very gratifying way to mentor and coach.

    And being their resource, if they hit a wall with some engagement, knowing they could come back to me and have their trust and share with them how I would handle it, how I have handled it in the past, also added to that satisfaction. So at that sort of midpoint of running the business, I was getting as much of a kick out of onboarding, training, coaching, mentoring, and supporting the consultants as I had been the clients in the first half of it. And that continued. So in your brain, right?

15. 14:13
    Wes Mathews

    When you make that leap, because you were probably the best, I think every entrepreneur goes through this, like I'm the best one for my company. And if your expectation is they're going to, somebody's going to deliver it at a hundred percent at the Dan Bauer level, like that's just never going to happen. It's like, what in your mind did you use to like, it's okay because nobody's going to deliver like you, no matter how much you train them. They're not you. You were the brainchild behind the company, right?

    How did you deal with that? Or like, what was that? How did you go forward with that?

16. 14:51
    Dan Bauer

    So as long as sort of the divergence from how exactly I would have done it was neutral, or maybe even better. These were super talented folks. They brought to the table their own passions, their own backgrounds. So I fought to remain open-minded. And before I would criticize or say this is not working, I would have them explain to me why they did what they did. What was your motivation? And how did it turn out? And essentially they would win ties. I was judicious and balanced in how I would give critical feedback.

    I would not jump on anyone and say, here's how you should have done it because that's how I would have done it. I really fought that and did not do that. So I would position it as my effort, sincere effort to learn from them and their methodology. And frankly, if they could convince me that it was as effective or better, that was all I needed to hear. And I would encourage them to keep doing it their way. I provided strategies and frameworks, but I didn't provide scripts because I wanted this to be, again, organic with how they would bond with a client.

    And so as I saw them spread their wings, do it in their own way, and found it effective, I could leave them to fly on their own and move on to the next newer one or one that was a little more borderline in their style. And so over time, you know, my tolerance for seeing it happen in a way that was different than I would have done it became to my own mental health became a good thing. Did you have a partner that handled processes?

17. 16:45
    Wes Mathews

    I mean, were you all of that? Were you leading the vision and the strategy and all the frameworks of your deliverable?

18. 16:51
    Dan Bauer

    Yeah, so I was doing all that. I added some direct hires a couple years into it. I added a very solid experienced director of operations. And then I brought the best of my consultants. I then promoted her and elevated her to my number two. And so she became my equal in terms of growing the business, running the business, managing it, and so on. So I leveraged myself with a couple of very hand-picked, duly deputized employees that I trusted 100% and vice versa. And so between that and, you know, I remain the strategic, you know, force and the visionary.

    The IP is what I developed. So I was able to train people, you know, really effectively. But realize that if this was going to grow, I could not be having 100 people report to me. And so that's the way that I grew it. So as a Harvard MBA and, you know, the founder of the MBA exchange, I mean,

19. 18:00
    Wes Mathews

    it's 2024 now, right? And I think you're a perfect guy to ask this question, because you have the experience. How important is an MBA college? You know, there's so with technology and YouTube, I mean, there's a lot of conversation. Like I have young kids now, right? And the college is on the horizon. But what does today look like versus 30 years ago? I mean, as an entrepreneur, do you see it's still the traditional way of, you know, if you know, you're going to be an entrepreneur, like, would you change up your path?

    Or what do you see to the future? Like, how do you comment on that?

20. 18:39
    Dan Bauer

    Yeah, so I'll draw back on my old days from the MBA exchange, when someone would ask me, what's the value of getting this? It's expensive. It you're sacrificing family time and taking a risk. There were really three components of it. I'm going to say there are four components of it, because there's a fourth one I wouldn't talk about very much. The first one is the knowledge itself that you gain. For me, I was a journalism major undergrad. I never had coursework in accounting, finance, operations, etc.

    So I needed that immersion, because I wanted to learn it. I wanted to be able to be comfortable with it and understand it. And so that's the easy one. As you mentioned, or alluded with the internet, there's ways to get knowledge. You can find websites, you can find, you know, free courses, frankly, in those disciplines. So that one was neutralized. The second value was the viewpoint, the perspective. To think strategically, think as a general manager, think broadly, understand risk-reward, ROI, things like that. That I needed the immersion in the MBA program, because I was fortunate.

    My program was all case studies, very little lecture, very little textbook. I was immersed into probably 400 real world, complex, stressful business scenarios over those two years. That's how I developed the perspective, to see above the fray and see past the obstacles and have a vision and develop a strategy around it. So perspective is something that comes with a top MBA, I found, that I would not have been able to develop certainly as quickly. The third value was the network, and this is where not all MBAs are equal.

    If someone is thinking about an MBA and can't get into a top 10 program, I would argue they should rethink it, because it's the relationships that were developed during those two years with incredible overachievers that have gone on to do amazing things. These are people who I was able to draw on year after year with a quick email or a phone call and could get feedback, could get introductions, references, all that good stuff. That would not have happened with that kind of you know, breadth and depth otherwise.

    So that was the third benefit that aided me and continues to aid me in my entrepreneurial journey. The fourth one that I didn't talk a lot about is brand, and again that's where that top 10 comes in. I went to a nice but not great undergrad school, Ohio University, Athens, Ohio. It was wonderful. I loved it, but it doesn't add any luster that would accelerate my entrepreneurial venture. But you throw a Harvard brand on there and it helps, because people who don't know you, there is that street cred, that you know, panache to it.

    And so that's the fourth thing that has helped my entrepreneurial journey, not just that, but now you know, now I'm leveraging it galore. Reconnecting with other alums, I have access to alumni networks that focus on entrepreneurship, conferences, webinars, it's non-stop. And so I'd say those are the four reasons why I'm a, I continue to be a huge fan of a top MBA for someone who's serious about an entrepreneurial future. There are those that will counter that, and I respect their point of view, but those are the four tangible things that could not have come in any other way for me.

21. 22:49
    Wes Mathews

    No, it's great, because I kind of joke with my oldest son, right? He won't be in college in four years, but I'm just very much like, it's not what you know, it's who you know. So to hear that, hey, if you're top school, the network, that's really important for people to think about. You know, because I think as an entrepreneur, you know, looking at hiring talent, like how much of that I know in your business, I mean, it's called the MBA exchange. So you're looking for MBA and, but like, as you look to other ventures or talk with your networks, how important is that for them or you to have an MBA or like, you know, being involved in an entrepreneurial run company, is that something where you're like, hey, like you have to have a bachelor's degree, you have to have an MBA, or has that world changed for you since becoming an entrepreneur?

    Like, would you look at people kind of the same way?

22. 23:42
    Dan Bauer

    I'll tell you, I would not say it's changed, but the significance of other entrepreneurial experiences and successes is now a huge consideration. So just to somebody who's, you know, age 28, and they've founded, grew, and sold three companies before they're 30, I'm not asking about their academic credentials. So the chance to build an entrepreneurial track record based on early successes and risks taken and rewards gained, I think that's, you know, that's certainly equal, if not more significant. I didn't have that. I'm envious of those young folks that do, but now the opportunity to get that is more open to people.

    And I think that carries a lot of weight these days. So, you know, that's the other side of the coin is if you're not going to invest the time and money in getting that top MBA, get out there, take some risks, join a, you know, a startup. If it fails, learn from it. Network. And, you know, that's another path that I would not subordinate to the one that I took.

23. 24:57
    Wes Mathews

    What kind of leads until, you know, we met, right? You founded in 2019, Inc. magazine's Young Entrepreneurs Program. I believe that's how we met. I don't even really remember exactly how we met. But, you know, your passion around young entrepreneurs and guiding them through school on their next thing included, hey, I need some entrepreneurs that have found some success to kind of help out. And I think it was something I latched on to relatively quickly, because I don't know, I just I had a different path in life where I didn't, I went to community college and I kind of stopped.

    So I think now, anytime talking to like a high school or somebody that's got some entrepreneurial chops, like I just, I love to see that anything I could do to be a part of that. So I think when you and I connected, it was like, yeah, like, let's go. It's a lot of fun. But talk about that, right? You took a couple years off, or you probably didn't take any time off. But somehow you landed into this, you know, Inc. magazine partnership. And now you're spearheading a really cool program.

    Love to learn more about that. Sure.

24. 25:54
    Dan Bauer

    So having sold my business, the MBA exchange in 2016, for the next couple years, I was doing marketing consulting, I was tapping into that network that I had been talking about. I loved, you know, the chance to have an impact on companies. It was intellectually very pleasing. But I realized I missed that coaching mentoring component of the MBA exchange. I didn't have a platform to do that. And so I felt that, you know, I think there's one more venture left in me. And that's going to be to start a camp.

    So I did my due diligence. I looked on, you know, on the web and saw a lot of so-called entrepreneurship camps for teens. Most of them were either run by university. So heavily academic bias, not a lot of real world. And the other was a, you know, a tech oriented, which was a bias, in my opinion, because a lot of young people are not interested in it in a software startup or an app, but something a little more conventional, a product or a service. And so I saw this room in the middle for a more pragmatic, broader based entrepreneurship program for high school kids.

    So realizing that I'm not a camp, I'm not a curriculum developer, I'm not a teacher, a certified teacher. And, you know, my name would not be a name that would be recognized as a sponsor. I put on my aggregator hat. And this is a very interesting strategy, I think, for entrepreneurs. And that is, I searched for and found best of class partners in each of the things that were needed to make this camp fly. A curriculum developer, access to certified teachers and entrepreneurship, a camp organization that had relationships with schools where they could get facilities, dorms, classrooms, and provide supervision for evenings and weekends.

    And finally, a brand. And I went out and did my homework and contacted each of the, you know, the best of the best in each of those categories. And so today, you know, I've aggregated an amazing group of partners, a wonderful camp partner called the National Student Leadership Conference, NSLC. They're the camp partner. A curriculum organization called NFT, N-F-T-E, Network for Teaching Entrepreneurship. That's what they do. They've done it all over the world. They have access to an alumni group of certified entrepreneurship teachers from high schools that are trained in the NFT curriculum.

    I access them, handpicked teachers for each of these. And then finally, I knew I needed a sponsor. And so, Inc. Magazine, I'd always subscribed to it for decades. It's the Bible of entrepreneurship. I approached them, told them about my other partners, and presented them with the chance to join in and be the sponsor. Everybody liked the idea of doing this. They liked the profile of the other partners. And I was able to essentially present my vision to them, and it all came together and is a smooth-running machine now.

    Inc. has been extremely helpful and supportive in giving me access to Inc. 5000 CEOs and founders, and that's how I found U.S., who are located locally near these campuses. As you said earlier, this summer we're at Columbia, Yale, Duke, Michigan, and UC Berkeley, prestigious great schools. And so, the entrepreneurs from the Inc. 5000, many of whom are also EO members, which I know you are, viewed this as the same way I view it, a chance to pay it forward, to engage and nurture them, share their stories, answer questions, and basically revisit, retell their story in a compelling, inspiring way.

    And all that magic has come together. The 2019 program was more of a pilot. That was online. Then, of course, COVID came in and changed agendas for a while. And then, for the last two summers, we've been doing it live. And this summer will be the biggest ever. Five campuses. I think our latest headcount is over 850 registered students, and they will be from across the country and around the world. It culminates in a pitch competition, which is about the most fun you can have. I know you've seen that competition and judged it, and I literally cannot wait.

    I'll be on all five campuses this summer, and it's just about as much fun as someone can have at this point in their career.

25. 31:07
    Wes Mathews

    Yeah, it's really cool. I think I've got to experience it now for two years and the judging part where the students fictitious create a product or service or something. They have to give a pitch in front of three entrepreneurs. And I just think back when I was in high school, how nervous I'd be at that age. And it's just really cool to see these kids because some of the time I would be in the room, and then after when I leave, they'd hang around and talk.

    And one of the kids, he pulled me aside. He's like, hey, my dad's in EO. And you said you were in EO. And he was almost in tears. And he's like, EO changed my dad's life, and it changed our family's life. And EO, I think, is very similar to how you were talking about your MBA program, which is this tight network of people shared around a vision that get into this program. Same thing with EO. There's certain qualifying factors of revenue and experience. So you're only around other entrepreneurs that are doing the same things you are, which is really cool.

    But it's really cool to see those students. They could be doing nothing in the summer, yet they choose to do this program, which is cool. Yes.

26. 32:20
    Dan Bauer

    It's very intensive. This year's program is nine straight days, from nine in the morning till nine at night. They have a lot of fun, too, that's built into it. But they're hungry to learn and get feedback. And to meet other kids who perhaps in their own high school, it's not a cool and exciting thing to be business-minded and business-oriented. So to be in a room, I think our sessions this year will be 50 kids together in an amphitheater and the chance to network. And I encourage this from day one.

    I asked them to raise their hands, who has a LinkedIn profile? And I said, by the time I see you again in a couple days, I'd like you to all have a LinkedIn profile and have everybody else in the program on there, including the speakers who you're going to meet. And so vicariously, it gives me a chance to see how the kids from the program advance. I'm seeing kids from a couple years ago who are now, you know, they're now juniors in college and they're in entrepreneurship clubs.

    Some of them are business majors, some are not. And I just know that, you know, big things ahead for them. And now they're connected with, you know, maybe a couple of hundred other kids who will become their peers in their network going forward. So it fills that void. As you said, that I got at Harvard, you got through EO. Here's a chance to do it at age 17. How's that for getting a head start on entrepreneurial success? It's pretty cool.

27. 33:51
    Wes Mathews

    Yeah, it was really cool. I think I had a couple kids reach out on LinkedIn. I had one, because I told the kids, I said, Hey, like reach out to me. If I can add any value. And a couple of them took it and had a couple of Zoom calls with them and just, you know, sent a couple of some books through Amazon and just, Hey, man, like, it's cool. They're thirsty to learn. And it's just great. I'll be honest. I think the last time I spoke in front of the group, I was, I was a little nervous.

    It was a tough crowd. They were asking me some tough questions. And I think one of the days, I think I just separated from our chief operating officer or something big happened. And I told them the story and told them the details. And they were asking me some pretty intimate questions about it. And then it was, it was just cool to see inquisitive minds. And I think it's, I think at some level, right? You have to get that street level entrepreneurial view. Like you can only learn so much out of a school book, but getting that real life perspective, it's interesting.

    Cause yeah, they're, they're young, they're young, hungry. And it's, it's, it's really a great program.

28. 34:48
    Dan Bauer

    Yeah. They, they liked the war stories. They want to hear about the stuff that didn't go right. It didn't go well, how you bounce back, how you rose above. Yeah. It's not a lot. They don't like the fluff. They want the, the dead and dirty, which is really fun to, fun to tell.

29. 35:03
    Wes Mathews

    So, so what does that mean for you? Right? So like when we met a lot of my sphere, my network, like they're all entrepreneurs, like how can entrepreneurs get involved or is there anything relative to Columbia, Yale, Duke university and UC Berkeley? Like how can anybody help you that kind of fits that entrepreneurial criteria? Like can they come in and mentor these kids or help out or what does that look like?

30. 35:26
    Dan Bauer

    Well, you know, it's one of the real pleasant surprises of all this is how the past speakers and judges have kept in touch with me and asking me when it's coming back. So a lot of the slots, frankly, are going to be easy to fill with folks that have knocked it out of the park in previous years. The other way that we're filling the spots is through ink magazine, through the roster of ink 5,000 winners. That's kind of the common credential that we look for is an ink 5,000 founder.

    This year we've even ramped it up more. We're looking for multiple winners of the ink 5,000. And so, you know, these, this is the cream of the cream. And, and so that's what we're doing right now. So it's a more proactive, I don't, I don't want this to sound arrogant or exclusive, but it's more of our initiative to go out and select the folks that we're having present. You know, if it was just about enthusiasm and desire and devotion to wanting to help kids, you know, that would be, that would be great.

    But we also want to present the most robust personal and professional stories. So right, for right now, we're being pretty selective and going out and tapping people on the shoulder through ink. And that's happening as we speak. We may hit a point, if someone cancels or what have you, that will, where we'd open it all up, up a little bit more. But for right now, I think we're, we're in pretty good shape on the, on the recruiting end. That's great.

31. 37:00
    Wes Mathews

    What, now in terms of like students, I mean, if, if there's a, how do you, how do you get into this program? Right? If I have a kid who I don't want to sit in front of video, like, is there a vetting process or what does that look like for a kid? Yep.

32. 37:16
    Dan Bauer

    So applications are taken through our camp partner, NSLC, National Student Leadership Conference. There's a landing page for this program that shows all the, you know, dates and locations and some of the background on it. So I would encourage anybody who's got a, you know, a teen son, daughter, nephew, niece, neighbor, what have you, or teachers that have students that they think could be, you know, benefit from this. To check out the NSLC, I believe it's nslcleaders.org is the URL. Check out the landing page and the application is on there.

    So, and a lot of the slots, frankly, are filled with siblings of kids that had an NSLC, NSLC program that they attended previously. So there's quite a following already, but they've just added a third section at Columbia. So I know that there's room for growth. No one will be turned away. They will add more capacity and we'll add more, you know, more sessions and more speakers for them.

33. 38:26
    Wes Mathews

    And you said to be in high school? You said to be a high school student?

34. 38:29
    Dan Bauer

    Yes. High school students, freshmen through seniors. Yeah. So that's the only, the only criteria.

35. 38:37
    Wes Mathews

    Now, are they all deployed at the, are they, can you go to

36. 38:41
    Dan Bauer

    Columbia's, Yale's, and Duke's and University of Michigan, or are they all running at the same time? No, you pick, there's some overlap, but it's, it's clearly the parents and the student who will pick the location they prefer. And as I said earlier, we've got kids from outside the country. Last year, I think we had kids from eight countries who came. And so they were getting the experience of not just a, you know, prestigious college campus, but also the community that they were in. So for example, you know, Columbia, the chance to experience New York City for, for a kid from India or China or Indiana, you know, or Texas, that was a pretty cool side benefit.

    And the camp builds into the curriculum, you know, social and sports things and entertainment things. So it's, it's a very, you know, inclusive, enriching experience. To be living in a dorm, sitting in a college classroom, and experiencing a city or a town, you know, I'd say that they'll have just as much fun in Durham, North Carolina, as they will in San Francisco and in Oakland with Berkeley. So that's part of the decision is what kind of environment the parents and the student want

37. 39:58
    Wes Mathews

    for their summer experience over the next year. It's pretty cool that kids are going to get taste of that this early on, right? Like building those relationships, those contacts, if you will, like, that's really cool.

38. 40:09
    Dan Bauer

    We really encourage on day one, some of the kids are shy or reluctant. But I'll tell you what, by the midpoint, they're with Friends for Life. And they're smart to do that. They're not just socially, you know, compatible, but they have this common bond of entrepreneurship, which is really pretty heavy, exciting stuff. And intuitively, they know that, you know, during college, after college, down the road, the kids in that classroom can be very valuable friends and allies and resources for them.

39. 40:46
    Wes Mathews

    No, that's really cool. So your entrepreneurial vision, where do you see this thing in three to five years? Do you just keep growing the curriculum and growing the headcount? Or what's the vision? Wow, that's terrific.

40. 40:57
    Dan Bauer

    I always have that next tier that I'm thinking about. So what I've thought about are some online versions of this during the school year. I'd love to be able to do that. Maybe an array of more specialized entrepreneurial programs, those that want tech, those that want healthcare, those who want something, a social enterprise. So I'm looking at sort of segmenting it a little bit more, offering some online version of it. That would be very gratifying to me. I'd also like to add some more advanced learning.

    For many of the kids who will go on to college, they'll be majoring in liberal arts, in history and romance languages, all kinds of non-business things. I'd love to augment their college curriculum. Depending on the school that they go to, they might not have access to business courses or certainly not entrepreneurship courses. So I'd like to offer this as sort of an extracurricular for our high school students, after they get into college, that they can use this to complement their course of study in college and stay on this track toward more formal, more sophisticated entrepreneurial learning.

    So by the time they graduate, they not only have their major in something that else has interested them, but they've also got the tools and the mindset and the resources to turn that into a business sometime. We tell parents that the value of this program is not limited to those that want to study business or become entrepreneurs. And I'm sure you'll relate to this too, Wes. The disciplines and the skills that one learns in studying entrepreneurship are applicable to everything in life, frankly, regardless of what they choose to do.

    And having that to rely on and fall back on 10, 20, 30 years later is a pretty valuable resource to have. So that's my vision for it is, don't let the value end when they leave campus after nine days, but that's a beginning, that's an entree, I mean, to more learning and more doing that I'd love to be able to fulfill.

41. 43:18
    Wes Mathews

    It'll be really cool to see some of your graduates come back, because you're going to get some kids that just... Some of the brightest kids that were in that room and I was lucky enough to have the experience to see it. It's a very well-ran program. The kids are really great. Everybody that was involved is really phenomenal. So a couple of things takeaways. One, it's if somebody wants to learn more about the program, where specifically should they go to learn about the program? Okay.

42. 43:44
    Dan Bauer

    So the website is nslcleaders.org. And then just search for business and entrepreneurship sponsored by Inc. magazine. That's the program. That's the landing page. It's got all the details on it. Perfect.

43. 44:00
    Wes Mathews

    Now, if somebody wants to reach out to you because something struck a chord, how can people get involved directly with you? Sure.

44. 44:06
    Dan Bauer

    So I'm on LinkedIn, Dan Bauer, and my website for my consulting practice is bauer-inc.com. My contact info is on there. More of my background is on there. So that would be the way to find me.

45. 44:28
    Wes Mathews

    And I think I'll be able to attach some of the Inc. information to this podcast too, so people can go to a landing page or find some information. But Dan, thanks so much for coming on. Keep doing what you're doing with the kids and everything you're doing. It's pretty awesome.

46. 44:40
    Dan Bauer

    Thanks for coming on. Thanks for your support and interest, Wes. You are from an entrepreneur, mentor, coach, judge standpoint. You are the exact model of what has made this program special. And I really appreciate your support. I look forward to seeing you probably in Ann Arbor this summer at the program. So thank you. Yeah.

47. 45:00
    Wes Mathews

    No, thanks so much. Appreciate it. Love doing it. It's one of my highlights of my summer to be able to do it. So thanks so much. We'll see you. Thanks. This has been another episode of Entrepreneur Intel. Thank you for joining us. For show notes or other episodes, please visit us at entrepreneurintel.com. Until next time.